According to Pirate101, El Dorado (Place of gold) is the biggest world in the Spiral, a place of pure gold and is the target for all pirates in the Spiral. But we've yet to hear the faintest whisper of such a place in W101, I personally think a world like this would be perfect in W101; particularly as the 'Hidden Lands' Old Cob mentioned.
But that's the biggest world, what else is close? Well (also from P101) on Marco Pollo's map we see Valencia is a huge powerful place, second to only El Dorado. After this would be either Grizzleheim or Skull Island, but smaller than that it grows difficult to distinguish. So of the largest worlds in the Spiral, wizards have set foot on Grizzleheim, and pirates have explored Skull Island (the home to most of them) and Valencia. Pirates have met people from all 3, and wizards have yet to see a (definitively) Skull Islander. So while these may have been discovered; El Dorado weighs heavy on the mind.
The farthest out worlds we know of are Celestia, El Dorado and (of course) Polaris. El Dorado being the place we're searching for, we must ask if it is through Polaris or Celestia that Marco Pollo's crew found El Dorado. Quite simply; it was through Celestia. How would I know? In Marco's letter addressing Prof. Ambrose, he says:
'I have confirmed your theory - the random perturbations of El Dorado's Stormgate are no accident - they occur by design. After the fall of this great city, the Celestians used their magic to unmoor the Stormgate from the fabric of the Spiral, to prevent anyone from ever coming here again.'
Fairly loaded with lore, I know, but we can relatively easily tell quite a few things from this. 1) The Celestians knew about El Dorado, and purposefully secluded the City of Gold from the rest of the Spiral (if I know anything about Celestians, they only do things with reasons of peace). 2) Merle Ambrose was associated with Marco's crew and their journeys, and kept his promise to them (not even telling his most trusted student about El Dorado). 3) El Dorado was supposedly a 'great city' that fell to something.
Later on he mentions defeating the Celestians' puzzle and that he has 'made an error in coming here'. Also that he 'shall devote the rest of my life to hiding the secret that I have uncovered' and Merle should 'keep silent to any inquiries about the City of Gold and its secrets'. If that isn't a massive plot twist to the utopia of El Dorado then I don't know what is. So where do we come in?
Celestia, world of a civilisation most (or close to) advanced and peaceful in the Spiral, had a Stormgate connecting the 2 worlds. Many theories state that Marleybone and Krokotopia would have as well, and given the advancements in MB and the sheer magic in KT it's unsurprising. But what other world is close? Polaris. The Auroracle warns of
'when the Sand settles, the Spiral shall end as it began... with a broken Heart.'
First things first, the map which you speak about may not be drawn to scale. So the "biggest" worlds may in fact not be the biggest. For example, Wizard City is clearly drawn as the largest in Wizard101 maps. Also in Wizard101 it is clearly referenced as the center of the spiral (that is where Bartleby is) however, the Wysterians believe they are the center and there are a number of Skymaps with Valencia or Marleybone drawn as the center. Also: Is Skull Island a break off of Azteca? You see Aztecasaurs quite early on and it makes sense that a lot of the ruins were Aztecasaur in design. I'm also confused as to how big worlds are/what shape. Mooshu is like a turtle in Pirate, but has a giant Mooda in Wizard. El Dorado is supposed to be the largest? It's times like these that I wish that I played Pirate- I might eventually. It will be interesting to see what else you have to say...
First things first, the map which you speak about may not be drawn to scale. So the "biggest" worlds may in fact not be the biggest. For example, Wizard City is clearly drawn as the largest in Wizard101 maps. Also in Wizard101 it is clearly referenced as the center of the spiral (that is where Bartleby is) however, the Wysterians believe they are the center and there are a number of Skymaps with Valencia or Marleybone drawn as the center. Also: Is Skull Island a break off of Azteca? You see Aztecasaurs quite early on and it makes sense that a lot of the ruins were Aztecasaur in design. I'm also confused as to how big worlds are/what shape. Mooshu is like a turtle in Pirate, but has a giant Mooda in Wizard. El Dorado is supposed to be the largest? It's times like these that I wish that I played Pirate- I might eventually. It will be interesting to see what else you have to say...
Staying tuned:
-exp613
To be perfectly honest about everything you mentioned about possible inaccuracies; this was made by the same person who made it to El Dorado. If the map exists as a path to El Dorado, then the crew would certainly want as little inaccuracies on the map as possible. They wouldn't want to go to all of this trouble just to find out later that there was an option for direct passage to El Dorado from Skull Island. Aside from that, the diagram of the Spiral actually doesn't see Wizard City at the centre; just extremely close. And if we compare that to Marco Pollo's map, the perihelion of Wizard City would make it one of the closest worlds along with Darkmoor, Aquila and some more unnamed worlds. Also note that in W101, you can access Aquila and Darkmoor only from Wizard City and also with such ease that they aren't even considered separate worlds.
On the topic of Azteca and Skull Island, it's actually a quite common source for debate. Personally, I think Azteca wouldn't be on this map (it was thought destroyed by Merle, so his friend Marco must've thought so too), but would be somewhere close to Wizard City and Skull Island. This is because Azteca is a fragment of the first world and there are many Aztecosaurs in Skull Island. For this reason, I think Azteca would lie in orbit around Marleybone (that's where we see it) and follow the same path as Wizard City. A bit of a tangent, but it helps us detail Marco Pollo's map.
What other worlds aren't labelled then? In W101, Wysteria, Avalon, Zafaria and Khrysalis. From P101, Cool Ranch. Mentioned? Mirage, Empyrea, Rajah, Yago, Nodor, Gobblerton/Candyland & Alissar. My original idea about this post was to theorise about El Dorado; but now I think it would be amazing if we could fully decode the map. Looking at it now, there's about 20 unnamed worlds, 12 of which aren't moons of any kind and 2 of them are completely out of any orbit whatsoever. This ought to be fun.
To be perfectly honest about everything you mentioned about possible inaccuracies; this was made by the same person who made it to El Dorado. If the map exists as a path to El Dorado, then the crew would certainly want as little inaccuracies on the map as possible. They wouldn't want to go to all of this trouble just to find out later that there was an option for direct passage to El Dorado from Skull Island. Aside from that, the diagram of the Spiral actually doesn't see Wizard City at the centre; just extremely close. And if we compare that to Marco Pollo's map, the perihelion of Wizard City would make it one of the closest worlds along with Darkmoor, Aquila and some more unnamed worlds. Also note that in W101, you can access Aquila and Darkmoor only from Wizard City and also with such ease that they aren't even considered separate worlds.
On the topic of Azteca and Skull Island, it's actually a quite common source for debate. Personally, I think Azteca wouldn't be on this map (it was thought destroyed by Merle, so his friend Marco must've thought so too), but would be somewhere close to Wizard City and Skull Island. This is because Azteca is a fragment of the first world and there are many Aztecosaurs in Skull Island. For this reason, I think Azteca would lie in orbit around Marleybone (that's where we see it) and follow the same path as Wizard City. A bit of a tangent, but it helps us detail Marco Pollo's map.
What other worlds aren't labelled then? In W101, Wysteria, Avalon, Zafaria and Khrysalis. From P101, Cool Ranch. Mentioned? Mirage, Empyrea, Rajah, Yago, Nodor, Gobblerton/Candyland & Alissar. My original idea about this post was to theorise about El Dorado; but now I think it would be amazing if we could fully decode the map. Looking at it now, there's about 20 unnamed worlds, 12 of which aren't moons of any kind and 2 of them are completely out of any orbit whatsoever. This ought to be fun.
Let's begin with the mentioned worlds, and (IMO) the coolest-named one; Rajah. The only time we meet any tigers from Rajah is on the Marleybonian Isle of Fetch, so it's logical to assume that Rajah is one of the unnamed worlds around MB. Given the position of the Isle of Fetch to the MB-->MS Stormgate, I'd say Rajah is the world between SI (Skull Island) & MB.
Now Empyrea has ties with Wysteria; so where's Wysteria then? Mentioned as a trade post in the WC cluster, I'd say WS is the (relatively) large world below WC on the map. And Empyrea? Polaris has a moon extremely close to this world just denoted as Wysteria, and I'd say the skies of Polaris were rather prominent; why wouldn't the moon be Empyrea?
Now then, Mirage. Probably the next world regardless of this, Mirage is very similar to Krokotopia and has some connections to Celestia. What world could possibly connect the two? To be honest, there isn't one. They're practically at opposite ends of the Spiral, but being similar to KT isn't reason enough to put it close to there. So where then? The small dot north-east of CL is hard to see, but would work perfectly. Close enough to Celestia for the Desert Star exchange, and close enough to the 'WC cluster' to have Nalia turn up in the Spiral Cup.
Next up, Yago. Goodness the WC cluster's getting crowded, and now we have to squeeze in a TotH world? Not quite. Because Kogasha (the Helephant in WS from YG) didn't go there by choice; he was brought there by a Dragonspyrian. This means a world close to DS would fit better, but close to both DS & WS would be perfect. DS has 3 empty worlds near it, but as we don't hear of Yago from Celestia or Valencia, Yago is likely the world above WC.
I'm essentially out of room, but the WC cluster is practically filled in (I think that moon on GH is WT btw), let's explore elsewhere at a different time.
According to Pirate101, El Dorado (Place of gold) is the biggest world in the Spiral, a place of pure gold and is the target for all pirates in the Spiral. But we've yet to hear the faintest whisper of such a place in W101, I personally think a world like this would be perfect in W101; particularly as the 'Hidden Lands' Old Cob mentioned.
But that's the biggest world, what else is close? Well (also from P101) on Marco Pollo's map we see Valencia is a huge powerful place, second to only El Dorado. After this would be either Grizzleheim or Skull Island, but smaller than that it grows difficult to distinguish. So of the largest worlds in the Spiral, wizards have set foot on Grizzleheim, and pirates have explored Skull Island (the home to most of them) and Valencia. Pirates have met people from all 3, and wizards have yet to see a (definitively) Skull Islander. So while these may have been discovered; El Dorado weighs heavy on the mind.
The farthest out worlds we know of are Celestia, El Dorado and (of course) Polaris. El Dorado being the place we're searching for, we must ask if it is through Polaris or Celestia that Marco Pollo's crew found El Dorado. Quite simply; it was through Celestia. How would I know? In Marco's letter addressing Prof. Ambrose, he says:
'I have confirmed your theory - the random perturbations of El Dorado's Stormgate are no accident - they occur by design. After the fall of this great city, the Celestians used their magic to unmoor the Stormgate from the fabric of the Spiral, to prevent anyone from ever coming here again.'
Fairly loaded with lore, I know, but we can relatively easily tell quite a few things from this. 1) The Celestians knew about El Dorado, and purposefully secluded the City of Gold from the rest of the Spiral (if I know anything about Celestians, they only do things with reasons of peace). 2) Merle Ambrose was associated with Marco's crew and their journeys, and kept his promise to them (not even telling his most trusted student about El Dorado). 3) El Dorado was supposedly a 'great city' that fell to something.
Later on he mentions defeating the Celestians' puzzle and that he has 'made an error in coming here'. Also that he 'shall devote the rest of my life to hiding the secret that I have uncovered' and Merle should 'keep silent to any inquiries about the City of Gold and its secrets'. If that isn't a massive plot twist to the utopia of El Dorado then I don't know what is. So where do we come in?
Celestia, world of a civilisation most (or close to) advanced and peaceful in the Spiral, had a Stormgate connecting the 2 worlds. Many theories state that Marleybone and Krokotopia would have as well, and given the advancements in MB and the sheer magic in KT it's unsurprising. But what other world is close? Polaris. The Auroracle warns of
'when the Sand settles, the Spiral shall end as it began... with a broken Heart.'
... But I need more space to finish this.
we did go to skull island in the five b.o.x.e.s event
According to Pirate101, El Dorado (Place of gold) is the biggest world in the Spiral, a place of pure gold and is the target for all pirates in the Spiral. But we've yet to hear the faintest whisper of such a place in W101, I personally think a world like this would be perfect in W101; particularly as the 'Hidden Lands' Old Cob mentioned.
But that's the biggest world, what else is close? Well (also from P101) on Marco Pollo's map we see Valencia is a huge powerful place, second to only El Dorado. After this would be either Grizzleheim or Skull Island, but smaller than that it grows difficult to distinguish. So of the largest worlds in the Spiral, wizards have set foot on Grizzleheim, and pirates have explored Skull Island (the home to most of them) and Valencia. Pirates have met people from all 3, and wizards have yet to see a (definitively) Skull Islander. So while these may have been discovered; El Dorado weighs heavy on the mind.
The farthest out worlds we know of are Celestia, El Dorado and (of course) Polaris. El Dorado being the place we're searching for, we must ask if it is through Polaris or Celestia that Marco Pollo's crew found El Dorado. Quite simply; it was through Celestia. How would I know? In Marco's letter addressing Prof. Ambrose, he says:
'I have confirmed your theory - the random perturbations of El Dorado's Stormgate are no accident - they occur by design. After the fall of this great city, the Celestians used their magic to unmoor the Stormgate from the fabric of the Spiral, to prevent anyone from ever coming here again.'
Fairly loaded with lore, I know, but we can relatively easily tell quite a few things from this. 1) The Celestians knew about El Dorado, and purposefully secluded the City of Gold from the rest of the Spiral (if I know anything about Celestians, they only do things with reasons of peace). 2) Merle Ambrose was associated with Marco's crew and their journeys, and kept his promise to them (not even telling his most trusted student about El Dorado). 3) El Dorado was supposedly a 'great city' that fell to something.
Later on he mentions defeating the Celestians' puzzle and that he has 'made an error in coming here'. Also that he 'shall devote the rest of my life to hiding the secret that I have uncovered' and Merle should 'keep silent to any inquiries about the City of Gold and its secrets'. If that isn't a massive plot twist to the utopia of El Dorado then I don't know what is. So where do we come in?
Celestia, world of a civilisation most (or close to) advanced and peaceful in the Spiral, had a Stormgate connecting the 2 worlds. Many theories state that Marleybone and Krokotopia would have as well, and given the advancements in MB and the sheer magic in KT it's unsurprising. But what other world is close? Polaris. The Auroracle warns of
'when the Sand settles, the Spiral shall end as it began... with a broken Heart.'
I apologise about not knowing about the Skull Islanders (I haven't done the ZF box), but I disagree with your second statement. If El Dorado were brought into W101, then it would likely be accessible through a Spiral Key (although anything to make such an elusive world more interesting would be brilliant); but any mention of a Stormgate in these posts is when I'm addressing a P101 detail. Anyway, I continued reading some more posts about filling in Marco's map and found more Spiral maps showing connections between worlds rather than orbits; all still show Valencia in the centre though. The most prominent would have to be the one on the floor of the Bruno Chapel. On it we see:
VA has connections to MS, MB and two unnamed worlds. MB then connects to a world shown by a hexagram (PL or CR) which is the end of that chain, MS connects to SI through another world which leads to another world. Doing some vague research of Marco's full map, the world between MS & SI is likely DS, and the world leading off from SI could be almost anywhere.
The third chain from VA is entirely unnamed, so we can assume that arm goes off the top of Marco's map, which would also fit with the positions of MS, MB, MQ & SI.
The fourth chain, however, goes VA, blank world, AQ, blank world, MQ, and ends. What could connect AQ to MQ? Looking at Marco's orbits for the two, it could be a WC Cluster world, DM, or a world off the top of the map. But the world from VA to AQ seems odd, as on Marco's map we see the two directly next to each other. But what worlds are closest to AQ? KT & DM. Both are just as valid, and perfectly understandable. The Valencian Armada's goal was (is) to remove magic from the Spiral, so why would they bother AQ? A world of magical gods wouldn't be bffs with VA, but a world just beyond AQ that oppresses magic would be fantastic. Besides; I think DM is the link from AQ to MQ.
So, I'm out of space; but that's most of Bruno Chapel sorted.
Where are you getting all this information? Aren't Pirate101 and Wizard101 just separate stories taking place in different Spirals?
I'd say they take place in the same Spiral for multiple reasons: 1) Almost identical worlds in every aspect (MS, MB). 2) We meet Skull Islanders and Armada Marines ripped straight from P101 in the ZF BOX. 3) The most important for this post: Marco Pollo's letter about his findings in El Dorado is addressed directly to Merle Ambrose. And the place I'm getting most of my information from is the 3-part decoding of the Spiral in the P101 Forums by Trade Moderator Sheldon.
Anyway, back to the Bruno Chapel, besides the hexagram off Marleybone and the mystery off SI, the question of this mysterious chain still remains. 4 worlds, one connected to VA and not one that has been explored in P101 yet. Now I left one of two options for where this chain could lead: the WC Cluster or The North. The former is probably the safest bet as we can guess many worlds in this area and be over and done with instantly; but that's too obvious. Also, it doesn't fit. The Armada's quest against magic decided to leave WC alone, so it wouldn't be an ally or enemy situation; mutual ignorance would be better. So why would VA position strong links to worlds in that area? Sure, GH is pretty big, but that area is brimming with magic, and VA wouldn't risk relations turning sour. So instead, we head into The North; off the map.
What worlds haven't been plotted (or at least guessed at) yet? Cool Ranch, Avalon, Zafaria, Alissar, Khrysalis, Nodor & Gobblerton/Candyland. Working backwards, the last two are likely very close to WC and very magical (witches/fairies); so not all too likely. Nodor (being the mammoth homeworld) would likely be close to Avalon or Wintertusk, but likely not an ally of VA. Khrysalis is likely remote given the plot around it, ZF & AL are probably close too, CR is mentioned as the farthest from the centre of the Spiral. Which leaves one:
Avalon is a powerful world, likely large, and the conflict between normal & magic is huge there. This would be a perfect ally for VA.
I do not believe that CandyWorld/Gobblerton is close to Wizard City. In the Ravenwood Roll Call Video about Lydia Greyrose it is stated that she is from a town near the Candied Isles, and that the Candied Isles rests between Penguinonia and Nodor. (With Penguinonia being more likely closer to Polaris and Nodor as you suggest by Wintertusk or Avalon.) I agree that both stories are in the same spiral as in Pirate don't you get told that the Emperor has been cursed by a Dark Wizard Malistaire? Wizard's use Spiral Keys to travel between Worlds is what Headmaster Ambrose tells young wizards as they first venture to Krokotopia. Stormgates (and possibly other methods) are how the "muggles" of the spiral venture from World to World. It says in Wizard that the Marleybonians got to Krokotopia by ship. You'll have to direct me to more information about the Polarian Wars, but wouldn't Polaris be a prime place to ally with Valencia? With the recent events in Polaris happening the whole Penguin Revolution and overthrowing of Antuskette she seems to be a very easy pawn that Valencia could control. Especially with the Wizards about to head off to Mirage. Polaris has Borealis Gemstones, which are very powerful magical gems and I see that as something that the Armada would be after. It would also make sense given that when Napoleguin was in power (by the way how did Antuskette get put in charge?) Valencia was his ally before he started turning on everyone.
I'd also like to mention the world of Wallaru has not been explored in either game yet, so who knows it may be coming!
Do you have a link to an image on the wiki of Marco Pollo's map? As I said I haven't really played too much Pirate101 so it would be nice to see what you are talking about.
I also agree that Yago is not in the Wizard City Cluster.
Also are Stormgates like portals? So worlds would not necessarily have to be geographically close?
Did Pollo see Celestia before or after the Storm Titan, as in before CL sank or after?
I apologise about not knowing about the Skull Islanders (I haven't done the ZF box), but I disagree with your second statement. If El Dorado were brought into W101, then it would likely be accessible through a Spiral Key (although anything to make such an elusive world more interesting would be brilliant); but any mention of a Stormgate in these posts is when I'm addressing a P101 detail. Anyway, I continued reading some more posts about filling in Marco's map and found more Spiral maps showing connections between worlds rather than orbits; all still show Valencia in the centre though. The most prominent would have to be the one on the floor of the Bruno Chapel. On it we see:
VA has connections to MS, MB and two unnamed worlds. MB then connects to a world shown by a hexagram (PL or CR) which is the end of that chain, MS connects to SI through another world which leads to another world. Doing some vague research of Marco's full map, the world between MS & SI is likely DS, and the world leading off from SI could be almost anywhere.
The third chain from VA is entirely unnamed, so we can assume that arm goes off the top of Marco's map, which would also fit with the positions of MS, MB, MQ & SI.
The fourth chain, however, goes VA, blank world, AQ, blank world, MQ, and ends. What could connect AQ to MQ? Looking at Marco's orbits for the two, it could be a WC Cluster world, DM, or a world off the top of the map. But the world from VA to AQ seems odd, as on Marco's map we see the two directly next to each other. But what worlds are closest to AQ? KT & DM. Both are just as valid, and perfectly understandable. The Valencian Armada's goal was (is) to remove magic from the Spiral, so why would they bother AQ? A world of magical gods wouldn't be bffs with VA, but a world just beyond AQ that oppresses magic would be fantastic. Besides; I think DM is the link from AQ to MQ.
So, I'm out of space; but that's most of Bruno Chapel sorted.
someone would have noticed a door appearing in there island because they are populated the skyways are dangerous and mostly unpopulated and also no one would ever head into an unknown stormgate but they would head into a spiral door that randomly appeared out of no where
blind mew from the p101 forums also stated that pirates don't want to get mixed up with a wizard business ( or something like that ) but wizards probably don't want to either so they leave el dorado to the pirates business
I do not believe that CandyWorld/Gobblerton is close to Wizard City. In the Ravenwood Roll Call Video about Lydia Greyrose it is stated that she is from a town near the Candied Isles, and that the Candied Isles rests between Penguinonia and Nodor. (With Penguinonia being more likely closer to Polaris and Nodor as you suggest by Wintertusk or Avalon.) I agree that both stories are in the same spiral as in Pirate don't you get told that the Emperor has been cursed by a Dark Wizard Malistaire? Wizard's use Spiral Keys to travel between Worlds is what Headmaster Ambrose tells young wizards as they first venture to Krokotopia. Stormgates (and possibly other methods) are how the "muggles" of the spiral venture from World to World. It says in Wizard that the Marleybonians got to Krokotopia by ship. You'll have to direct me to more information about the Polarian Wars, but wouldn't Polaris be a prime place to ally with Valencia? With the recent events in Polaris happening the whole Penguin Revolution and overthrowing of Antuskette she seems to be a very easy pawn that Valencia could control. Especially with the Wizards about to head off to Mirage. Polaris has Borealis Gemstones, which are very powerful magical gems and I see that as something that the Armada would be after. It would also make sense given that when Napoleguin was in power (by the way how did Antuskette get put in charge?) Valencia was his ally before he started turning on everyone.
I'd also like to mention the world of Wallaru has not been explored in either game yet, so who knows it may be coming!
Do you have a link to an image on the wiki of Marco Pollo's map? As I said I haven't really played too much Pirate101 so it would be nice to see what you are talking about.
I also agree that Yago is not in the Wizard City Cluster.
Also are Stormgates like portals? So worlds would not necessarily have to be geographically close?
Did Pollo see Celestia before or after the Storm Titan, as in before CL sank or after?
This post was extremely detailed, and thank you for bringing up the worlds I forgot about. The rules only say sites like W101 Central can be linked to, but I hope there's no harm in a P101 Central link. Even so, I'll post in bulk later on in case the link stops this being posted:
Thank you for posting the link that was most helpful.
I agree with MarioKing that Blind Mew supposedly said that Pirates and Wizards plan to keep their distance between each other. I don't think that Wizards will venture too far into El Dorado after all that is the Pirates' Chief goal, not the Wizards.
I don't think Spiral Doors just "appear" out of thin air. They have to be constructed, probably by a Wizard, and it requires powerful magic.
The Professor's Telegraph Box is a "pekuliarity" on it's own....
I find it interesting that there is a straight line connecting Wizard City to Grizzleheim and Marleybone. Which in the article suggests that there are Stormgates connecting the two places. This would explain Arthur Wethersfield and Harold Argleston being able to come to Wizard City and perhaps more interestingly, Bauldur Goldpaws. Bauldur traveled to Wizard City the old fashioned way via ship and almost definitely via Stormgate! (Given Pollo's map connecting the Worlds and also the fact that Bauldur tells the Wizard that it will be a "quick trip" when the Wizard helps him set up trade agreements between the worlds.) It would be cool if we got to see that Stormgate as we left as a nod to Pirate101.
It's also interesting that there are two worlds that are not connected via orbit nor via Stormgate to anything. (One by Krokotopia and another by Mooshu) I don't know how Marco Pollo would have known about them or maybe he thought they were just uninhabited rocks or didn't bother charting their courses as they are inconsequential. However, I imagine that the Arcanum would function like one of these worlds, that it is in the same dimension as the Spiral, but doesn't rotate like the other worlds, and is in a fixed geographical locale. (This makes sense as the Scholars wouldn't want Pirates to accidentally stumble across something like the Arcanum.) They made sure that only Wizard's with the Spiral Key for the Arcanum would be able to access it via Spiral Door alone.
I do not believe that CandyWorld/Gobblerton is close to Wizard City. In the Ravenwood Roll Call Video about Lydia Greyrose it is stated that she is from a town near the Candied Isles, and that the Candied Isles rests between Penguinonia and Nodor. (With Penguinonia being more likely closer to Polaris and Nodor as you suggest by Wintertusk or Avalon.) I agree that both stories are in the same spiral as in Pirate don't you get told that the Emperor has been cursed by a Dark Wizard Malistaire? Wizard's use Spiral Keys to travel between Worlds is what Headmaster Ambrose tells young wizards as they first venture to Krokotopia. Stormgates (and possibly other methods) are how the "muggles" of the spiral venture from World to World. It says in Wizard that the Marleybonians got to Krokotopia by ship. You'll have to direct me to more information about the Polarian Wars, but wouldn't Polaris be a prime place to ally with Valencia? With the recent events in Polaris happening the whole Penguin Revolution and overthrowing of Antuskette she seems to be a very easy pawn that Valencia could control. Especially with the Wizards about to head off to Mirage. Polaris has Borealis Gemstones, which are very powerful magical gems and I see that as something that the Armada would be after. It would also make sense given that when Napoleguin was in power (by the way how did Antuskette get put in charge?) Valencia was his ally before he started turning on everyone.
I'd also like to mention the world of Wallaru has not been explored in either game yet, so who knows it may be coming!
Do you have a link to an image on the wiki of Marco Pollo's map? As I said I haven't really played too much Pirate101 so it would be nice to see what you are talking about.
I also agree that Yago is not in the Wizard City Cluster.
Also are Stormgates like portals? So worlds would not necessarily have to be geographically close?
Did Pollo see Celestia before or after the Storm Titan, as in before CL sank or after?
Well, then, back to this fantastic wall of in-game lore. So then, on the topic of Penguinonia (which I forgot about) and Nodor; this helps with the location of Nodor. With this new information of a world being near Polaris doesn't strictly rule out the WC Cluster idea. As it would appear from its orbit on Marco's map, it does circle around MB at some point, but as an orbit that close would be faster than an orbit farther out (the rest of PL's orbit); so no links between CL/GT and ND could really be founded. But as I think AV is on the opposite side of the map, possibly far out enough to intersect with PL, assuming CL/GT is above the map would make more sense than throwing it into the fray of the WC Cluster.
I fully agree with your thoughts on Stormgates being the non-magical approach to inter-planetary travel that doesn't demand a grievous Skyway flight. Also, Stormgates may not require a specific location, but on full Spiral Skyway maps I've seen; they oft point towards the world they take you to.
Actually, Polaris were sworn enemies of Valencia in the Polarian War. What happened was Napoleguin thought Polaris was undefeatable, and so he turned on his 3 greatest allies: Monquista, Marleybone & Valencia. The Valencian Armada was called in later in the war to finish off the Polarian Navy along with a Marleybonian revolution against Polaris and betrayal from the Polar Bears. I believe the reason Valencia has largely ignored Polaris since would be the Auroracle and her guards. Polaris, WC, Wintertusk and Khrysalis have all been left well alone by Valencia; and I think it's because they don't want to wage war against immortals. Even Celestia, possibly the most advanced civilisation in the Spiral, couldn't handle a Titan; imagine fighting Bartleby, Auroracle, Raven or Cob.
Wallaru is interesting. Yes I forgot about it, but I think it would be either the same world or a twin world with Cool Ranch. Just a thought.
Can you tell me more about these worlds? I've heard of Mirage and Empyrea, but I don't know much about those. What do you know about the other worlds (maybe include Mirage and Empyrea anyway, I might learn something new).
Can you tell me more about these worlds? I've heard of Mirage and Empyrea, but I don't know much about those. What do you know about the other worlds (maybe include Mirage and Empyrea anyway, I might learn something new).
Sure thing:
Rajah was mentioned in Pirate101 on the Isle of Fetch, Marleybone, by Jadbal Chand in the quest 'Fearful Symmetry'. The species from here (we know of) are called 'Kurghas', and both species look like felines; variants of tigers. Various words used point to Sikhism, Nepal and India. Given their relation to Marleybone, I assume Rajah would be akin to colonial India and near Marleybone (hence why I put it where I did).
Yago was mentioned in Wizard101 in the Tower of the Helephant, Wysteria, by Kogasha in the quest 'The Helephant's Heart'. The species from here (we know of) are Helephants/Demons/Oni. Kogasha describes his home as 'in peace with my people within the star-fields of Yago'. I, myself, looking more into this world have changed my opinion on where it would be. I placed it above WC city for no reason, but as these Helephants appear elsewhere in the Spiral - Mooshu - I think Yago would be either Mooshu's moon or the rogue planet sailing by it. Inbetween DS & MS, not thrown into the WC Cluster.
Nodor was mentioned many times across Avalon, but most memorably by Innes Idle in the quest 'I Wanna Be Adored'. In this quest, he asks you to find him 'A Map to the Brisk Land of Nodor'. This shows that it's close enough to Avalon for a mere minstrel to journey there, and that it contains Fomori/Mammoths. Be it a full fledged world nearby or a moon around Avalon, it has to be near there.
Gobblerton and Candyland were (essentially) joke worlds mentioned among Wizard City as the homeworlds for the Gobblers and Lydia Greyrose. But in 2015 they were expanded upon with a new area known as the 'Candied Isles' existing between Nodor & Penguinonia. Among these lies Greyrose's home 'Karamelle'.
I'm almost out of room (Allissar will come) but I'd also like to say the world I previously thought was Empyrea due to the reasoning of 'why not?' would likely not be Empyrea. I think Polaris' moon would be Penguinonia. OR PN could be above VA with KM & ND.
Where are you getting all this information? Aren't Pirate101 and Wizard101 just separate stories taking place in different Spirals?
wizard101 and pirate101 are the same spiral but they are supposed to be on a different time. when we go on the five boxes event we go back in time before the pirate101 story begins. marleybone looks from much before than the wizard101 but in some way the time is similar, Because on p101 Mooshu a character talks to us on a puppet show about the emperor that has fallen into a sleep because of a magician and appears Malistaire. so basically is a mix of time and different areas on the same worlds from each game
Also some have speculated that the pictures in the Arcanum Fire Scholar's Classroom are from Yago, this is mostly just speculation though at the moment.
Empyrea is home to Sky-Squids you get sneak peaks of some of them in the Pirate101 Puppet shows. They look kind of like a humanoid with a squid for a head and bat wings from what I've seen.
Gobblerton/CandyWorld are not "joke" worlds. See Original Post from Professor Greyrose I think it would be cool to see CandyWorld/Gobblerton/Karamelle/The Candied Isles. Maybe one day....
Alissar, Penguinonia, Gobblerton, Nodor, Walzakistan (and others) also have the potential to not be a World/Moon but just an area that is part of a World. Personally, I think that Alissar is part of ZF and Gobblerton part of CandyLand, but that's just speculation. I suppose I also have to think that the term is really satelite, not necessarily "moon" as it is probably just a smaller island off of the motherland of the primary world like in Pirate.
I would imagine (and sincerely hope) that Wallaru is by no means connected or associated with Cool Ranch. Cool Ranch is based off the American West and to put Australia smack into the middle of it to me wouldn't make sense. So again, I believe Wallaru to be independent of Cool Ranch.
I see no reason to believe Penguinonia is part of Valencia. It is part of Polaris- willing to bet crowns on that fact.
Also after watching the latest KI Live event it sounds like the first Arc in Pirate is now complete, so we'll have to see where the story goes from there.
I was also excited to see the increase in the number of references to Valencia in Wizard! Benedict Flendemming and Diego are both the Unicorns and you have the incident at Barkingham Palace with a Valencian and now it looks like they are even coming out with a Valencia Gauntlet! (I think it's part of a bundle) So technically via the gauntlet Wizards can take their first steps in Valencia!
Also I wonder if there is like a Spiral Timeline somewhere...
Also some have speculated that the pictures in the Arcanum Fire Scholar's Classroom are from Yago, this is mostly just speculation though at the moment.
Empyrea is home to Sky-Squids you get sneak peaks of some of them in the Pirate101 Puppet shows. They look kind of like a humanoid with a squid for a head and bat wings from what I've seen.
Gobblerton/CandyWorld are not "joke" worlds. See Original Post from Professor Greyrose I think it would be cool to see CandyWorld/Gobblerton/Karamelle/The Candied Isles. Maybe one day....
Alissar, Penguinonia, Gobblerton, Nodor, Walzakistan (and others) also have the potential to not be a World/Moon but just an area that is part of a World. Personally, I think that Alissar is part of ZF and Gobblerton part of CandyLand, but that's just speculation. I suppose I also have to think that the term is really satelite, not necessarily "moon" as it is probably just a smaller island off of the motherland of the primary world like in Pirate.
I would imagine (and sincerely hope) that Wallaru is by no means connected or associated with Cool Ranch. Cool Ranch is based off the American West and to put Australia smack into the middle of it to me wouldn't make sense. So again, I believe Wallaru to be independent of Cool Ranch.
I see no reason to believe Penguinonia is part of Valencia. It is part of Polaris- willing to bet crowns on that fact.
Also after watching the latest KI Live event it sounds like the first Arc in Pirate is now complete, so we'll have to see where the story goes from there.
I was also excited to see the increase in the number of references to Valencia in Wizard! Benedict Flendemming and Diego are both the Unicorns and you have the incident at Barkingham Palace with a Valencian and now it looks like they are even coming out with a Valencia Gauntlet! (I think it's part of a bundle) So technically via the gauntlet Wizards can take their first steps in Valencia!
Also I wonder if there is like a Spiral Timeline somewhere...
I personally think the squids in the P101 puppet shows are just generic funny evil creatures (although some people think it's Cthulhu or something along those lines and it's what destroyed El Dorado).
I elaborated on why the Candied Isles aren't actually joke worlds, and I think Alissar would certainly be close to/a part of Zafaria.
It wouldn't be Australia, it'd be Native North America. Which would fit perfectly with the theme of Cool Ranch.
I didn't say it'd be part of Valencia, I was just running out of space and things got confusing. When I said above Valencia, I meant above the map we have so far, I personally think it is the moon around Polaris.
Yes, Book XV came out for Pirate101 very recently after the literal YEARS it had been waited for, so things are certainly going to be interesting as more and more pirates progress into more and more lore.
I'm also looking forward to the Clockwork Gauntlet (at least I think it's something along those lines) and as the references to Valencia increase, I feel more and more confident that they are the 'fleeting empires' Old Cob refers to.
And about that timeline, I am going to look for that right now.
Certain parts look fairly uncertain and certain parts (Such as where Pirate101 occurs) but most of these mistakes are highlighted in replies. It seems rather handy, I'll have to bookmark that.
Halley's Observatory (http://www.wizard101central.com/wiki/Location:Halley's_Observatory) looks like a combination of Wizard City and Marleybone. Could it be the island that connected the two worlds when the Spiral was one giant land mass? This probably puts Marleybone near Wizard City.
Rajah was mentioned in Pirate101 on the Isle of Fetch, Marleybone, by Jadbal Chand in the quest 'Fearful Symmetry'. The species from here (we know of) are called 'Kurghas', and both species look like felines; variants of tigers. Various words used point to Sikhism, Nepal and India. Given their relation to Marleybone, I assume Rajah would be akin to colonial India and near Marleybone (hence why I put it where I did).
Yago was mentioned in Wizard101 in the Tower of the Helephant, Wysteria, by Kogasha in the quest 'The Helephant's Heart'. The species from here (we know of) are Helephants/Demons/Oni. Kogasha describes his home as 'in peace with my people within the star-fields of Yago'. I, myself, looking more into this world have changed my opinion on where it would be. I placed it above WC city for no reason, but as these Helephants appear elsewhere in the Spiral - Mooshu - I think Yago would be either Mooshu's moon or the rogue planet sailing by it. Inbetween DS & MS, not thrown into the WC Cluster.
Nodor was mentioned many times across Avalon, but most memorably by Innes Idle in the quest 'I Wanna Be Adored'. In this quest, he asks you to find him 'A Map to the Brisk Land of Nodor'. This shows that it's close enough to Avalon for a mere minstrel to journey there, and that it contains Fomori/Mammoths. Be it a full fledged world nearby or a moon around Avalon, it has to be near there.
Gobblerton and Candyland were (essentially) joke worlds mentioned among Wizard City as the homeworlds for the Gobblers and Lydia Greyrose. But in 2015 they were expanded upon with a new area known as the 'Candied Isles' existing between Nodor & Penguinonia. Among these lies Greyrose's home 'Karamelle'.
I'm almost out of room (Allissar will come) but I'd also like to say the world I previously thought was Empyrea due to the reasoning of 'why not?' would likely not be Empyrea. I think Polaris' moon would be Penguinonia. OR PN could be above VA with KM & ND.
Can you expand upon Karamelle, Penguinonia, Wallaru, and Alissar?
Also, what do all your abbreviations mean? I only know some.
Also some have speculated that the pictures in the Arcanum Fire Scholar's Classroom are from Yago, this is mostly just speculation though at the moment.
Empyrea is home to Sky-Squids you get sneak peaks of some of them in the Pirate101 Puppet shows. They look kind of like a humanoid with a squid for a head and bat wings from what I've seen.
Gobblerton/CandyWorld are not "joke" worlds. See Original Post from Professor Greyrose I think it would be cool to see CandyWorld/Gobblerton/Karamelle/The Candied Isles. Maybe one day....
Alissar, Penguinonia, Gobblerton, Nodor, Walzakistan (and others) also have the potential to not be a World/Moon but just an area that is part of a World. Personally, I think that Alissar is part of ZF and Gobblerton part of CandyLand, but that's just speculation. I suppose I also have to think that the term is really satelite, not necessarily "moon" as it is probably just a smaller island off of the motherland of the primary world like in Pirate.
I would imagine (and sincerely hope) that Wallaru is by no means connected or associated with Cool Ranch. Cool Ranch is based off the American West and to put Australia smack into the middle of it to me wouldn't make sense. So again, I believe Wallaru to be independent of Cool Ranch.
I see no reason to believe Penguinonia is part of Valencia. It is part of Polaris- willing to bet crowns on that fact.
Also after watching the latest KI Live event it sounds like the first Arc in Pirate is now complete, so we'll have to see where the story goes from there.
I was also excited to see the increase in the number of references to Valencia in Wizard! Benedict Flendemming and Diego are both the Unicorns and you have the incident at Barkingham Palace with a Valencian and now it looks like they are even coming out with a Valencia Gauntlet! (I think it's part of a bundle) So technically via the gauntlet Wizards can take their first steps in Valencia!
Also I wonder if there is like a Spiral Timeline somewhere...
Walzakistan? Can you elaborate on that too?
How are you finding out about all these other worlds?
This post was extremely detailed, and thank you for bringing up the worlds I forgot about. The rules only say sites like W101 Central can be linked to, but I hope there's no harm in a P101 Central link. Even so, I'll post in bulk later on in case the link stops this being posted:
Links to two other pages of the decoding can be found near the beginning of his text.
I think I have potential evidence that wizards will be visiting El Dorado. Listen to me here.
At the end of Briskbreeze Tower, Lieutenant Culpepper, the guard we rescue, "recounted his adventure and said that Orrick described something terrible that was coming to the Spiral, and that Krokotopia was the next step. However, he quickly dismissed such thoughts, glad to be alive. But Orrick left us something - two keys. One 'made of bone, and the other...covered with hieroglyphs.' KingsIsle never followed up on that story, but even foes like Morganthe can't 'come to the Spiral.' Now what could that mean?"
I have a theory. In the post you linked, it says Krokotopia could have the entrance to El Dorado. Krokotopia could be 'the next step' to wizards going to El Dorado.
I think I have potential evidence that wizards will be visiting El Dorado. Listen to me here.
At the end of Briskbreeze Tower, Lieutenant Culpepper, the guard we rescue, "recounted his adventure and said that Orrick described something terrible that was coming to the Spiral, and that Krokotopia was the next step. However, he quickly dismissed such thoughts, glad to be alive. But Orrick left us something - two keys. One 'made of bone, and the other...covered with hieroglyphs.' KingsIsle never followed up on that story, but even foes like Morganthe can't 'come to the Spiral.' Now what could that mean?"
I have a theory. In the post you linked, it says Krokotopia could have the entrance to El Dorado. Krokotopia could be 'the next step' to wizards going to El Dorado.
What do you think?
Phew, a lot of things. Well, on the topic of Marleybone & Wizard City, they're already close on Marco's map, so that isn't really something we needed to pin down. On the topic of the keys, at level 60 we give them both to Alhazred he 'will keep the Bone Key safe' and we use the hieroglyph key to enter Zigazag. So, this Bone Key could of course lead to El Dorado (Bone Key, Skull Island); but we don't know yet. Also, could you elaborate on your Morganthe statement, I don't quite understand. Also, Walzakistan is mentioned in Polaris I think, all mentioned worlds are mentioned in dialogue somewhere in the game. But now then; abbreviations.
Skull Island - SI, Monquista - MQ, Cool Ranch - CR, El Dorado - ED, Valencia - VA.
Mirage - MR, Empyrea - EM, Rajah - RJ, Nodor - ND, Yago - YG, Gobblerton/Candyland - GT/CL (I forgot about Celestia for this one, but I'll just use Karamelle for now anyway), Alissar - AS, Karamelle - KM, Penguinonia - PG, Wallaru - WL, Walzakistan - WZ.
