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Hello, fellow Saviors of the Spiral! This post contains my perspective, so I am expecting it to be misinformed. Please help me understand. Thanks!

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When I ask people their opinion on the pros and cons of an Ice wizard, they spew exactly what Ice is supposed to be described as:

• Pros: high health, high resistance, access to the mighty Tower
• Cons: Lowest damage (by a kilometer), average-to-bad accuracy

If this list was true, that’d would make a lot of sense: you sacrifice offensive prowess for defensive walling. Polar opposite to Storm! However, as a practicing Ice wizard (at time of writing, lvl 85 and through Avalon who does not PVP yet), I feel you have to severely alter the list by removing pros and tacking on a con.

• Pros: high health
• Cons: Lowest damage, average-to-bad accuracy, high amount of useless utility

Ice doesn't have high resistance... I regularly check the stats of awesome non-Ice wizards, and their resistances are universally high (often to the point of being immune to entire schools). And this is due to equipment. With universal armor, nothing indicates Ice has any advantage in being a tanky wall. Described-strength nullified.

Access to the Tower Shield is irrelevant. Not only is Tower trainable, it’s easily trainable at a low level. Any school can have it, once again nullifying a described strength. I can grant you Legion Shield is pretty unique and useful, but only if your questing in large groups – only adding to the argument Ice is severely underbalanced and can’t be played without assistance.

Ice utility spells are useless. When you look at the list of Ice spells on the W101 page, you see a plethora of irrelevant Taunt & Tick utility. Mainboarding these spells leads to nearly-always discarding it as a dead card. They’re very situational, and using them is far more often a liability than a strength. Sure, there are a couple that are often handy - such as stun block - but on the most part, they are laughably useless compared to other schools (IE double-stuns, mass traps, enfeeblement, weakness, pip-ramping, etc).

Ice spells longevity. Let’s look at the flashy new Celestial Intervention (which is currently in Test Realm at time of writing). I'll first start with something positive: it's the first time Ice has gotten a heal (inaugural), and it's mechanics are very Ice-fitting! However.... past the flavor, it's so bad, casting it will always put you behind. Why? Well, because it's a 300HP self-only heal that not only costs 4 pips, but also comes with a HUGE drawback (those shields will prevent more damage than a measly 300HP). That's worse than casting a 1-pip taunt, as both are useless, but one doesn't directly hurt you. NOTE: I actually posted a discussion post on this a couple weeks ago, so a moderator can erase that in favor of this if they so please!

To sum it up...if all the other schools – including the powerhouses – have equally high resistance as Ice wizards, far better utility than Ice wizards, and damage output that laughs at anything with a Snowflake in its cost, then Ice canNOT be considered a tanking school. It cannot really be considered an anything school. It's just there. Bad.

To that end, my question! As a fairly-noob player (without the most experience), can someone explain to me if I'm missing something? Does Ice actually have qualities that are good besides high health? What are they? Because as of now, due to armor, spell utility, and damage output, there is no reason Ice can be considered on par with any other school.

I love underdog choices (in anything), so even if Ice is designed to be the bottom tiered school, it still holds my frozen heart. Just wanted some input from either game reps or fellow archmages.

Thanks!

Snow Lands On Top,
Talon Silverpetal

tclark1005 on Jul 21, 2020 wrote:

Hello, fellow Saviors of the Spiral! This post contains my perspective, so I am expecting it to be misinformed. Please help me understand. Thanks!

---

When I ask people their opinion on the pros and cons of an Ice wizard, they spew exactly what Ice is supposed to be described as:

• Pros: high health, high resistance, access to the mighty Tower
• Cons: Lowest damage (by a kilometer), average-to-bad accuracy

If this list was true, that’d would make a lot of sense: you sacrifice offensive prowess for defensive walling. Polar opposite to Storm! However, as a practicing Ice wizard (at time of writing, lvl 85 and through Avalon who does not PVP yet), I feel you have to severely alter the list by removing pros and tacking on a con.

• Pros: high health
• Cons: Lowest damage, average-to-bad accuracy, high amount of useless utility

Ice doesn't have high resistance... I regularly check the stats of awesome non-Ice wizards, and their resistances are universally high (often to the point of being immune to entire schools). And this is due to equipment. With universal armor, nothing indicates Ice has any advantage in being a tanky wall. Described-strength nullified.

Access to the Tower Shield is irrelevant. Not only is Tower trainable, it’s easily trainable at a low level. Any school can have it, once again nullifying a described strength. I can grant you Legion Shield is pretty unique and useful, but only if your questing in large groups – only adding to the argument Ice is severely underbalanced and can’t be played without assistance.

Ice utility spells are useless. When you look at the list of Ice spells on the W101 page, you see a plethora of irrelevant Taunt & Tick utility. Mainboarding these spells leads to nearly-always discarding it as a dead card. They’re very situational, and using them is far more often a liability than a strength. Sure, there are a couple that are often handy - such as stun block - but on the most part, they are laughably useless compared to other schools (IE double-stuns, mass traps, enfeeblement, weakness, pip-ramping, etc).

Ice spells longevity. Let’s look at the flashy new Celestial Intervention (which is currently in Test Realm at time of writing). I'll first start with something positive: it's the first time Ice has gotten a heal (inaugural), and it's mechanics are very Ice-fitting! However.... past the flavor, it's so bad, casting it will always put you behind. Why? Well, because it's a 300HP self-only heal that not only costs 4 pips, but also comes with a HUGE drawback (those shields will prevent more damage than a measly 300HP). That's worse than casting a 1-pip taunt, as both are useless, but one doesn't directly hurt you. NOTE: I actually posted a discussion post on this a couple weeks ago, so a moderator can erase that in favor of this if they so please!

To sum it up...if all the other schools – including the powerhouses – have equally high resistance as Ice wizards, far better utility than Ice wizards, and damage output that laughs at anything with a Snowflake in its cost, then Ice canNOT be considered a tanking school. It cannot really be considered an anything school. It's just there. Bad.

To that end, my question! As a fairly-noob player (without the most experience), can someone explain to me if I'm missing something? Does Ice actually have qualities that are good besides high health? What are they? Because as of now, due to armor, spell utility, and damage output, there is no reason Ice can be considered on par with any other school.

I love underdog choices (in anything), so even if Ice is designed to be the bottom tiered school, it still holds my frozen heart. Just wanted some input from either game reps or fellow archmages.

Thanks!

Snow Lands On Top,
Talon Silverpetal

My opinion might change after this recent update, with so many spells being nerfed or altered. This is what I thought about Ice last week, so to speak.

Ice is one of my favorite schools, along with Fire and Death. All these schools have damage over time spells, which make questing PvE very easy. For me personally, that's a huge selling point. I like not having to worry about shields. The other things I particularly like as an Ice are the 40% blade, the Steal Ward, the Stun for 0 pips, and the beautiful Reindeer Knight spell. Steal Ward is great because you don't just get rid of a pesky shield, you can keep it for yourself! You don't have to waste blades or traps/feints, either. Steal Ward is like a Pierce/Tower combo move for 2 pips.

Ice against an Ice boss, for example: I pack Steal Wards and use that boss's defenses for myself while also packing prisms and laying on the DoT spells. My Ice is level 86 and has soloed a lot, even challenging bosses like Belloq in Zafaria and also the Jabberwocky in Avalon (much to my shock, LOL). In fact, my Ice was the first time I was successful in soloing Belloq. In his case, I think the high resist plus the 40% Ice blade made a difference. I put up a Tower, then a blade, then hit with Reindeer Knight or Frostbite. Repeat until he's dead.

I would say, the point is not that other schools can do what Ice does. (For example, Death and Fire both have DoT spells, Balance and Life both have shields, Death and Balance have great utility spells.) The question is, does the overall style of the school suit you? Honestly, Ice might not be a good psychological fit for everyone. It's vibe is slow and steady.... If that's not your jam, you could try a different school.

For example, Storm is radically different--very fast moving. The goal is hit fast before you die! Or, try Fire, which keeps the DoT spells but trades health and resist for much higher damage. Fire burns things down fast. Balance is a lot like Ice, so I think you might not like it, but Death self-mutilates to get the job done. They are dark souls who love risk.

I'm not sure if I answered your question, maybe because I don't see Ice as being a bottom tiered school. (That, sadly, has been Myth.) Up until recently, Ice was a top tier school in PvP because of its health, resist and utility. There are several Ice spells that combine stuns and damage, and those plus the health and resist made Ice a dreaded foe in PvP. Add the ability to self-heal, and Ice becomes nearly invincible. In PvE, the slow and steady pace also has advantages as long as you're prepared for a longer fight.

If you're in a hurry and looking for damage first, however, then Ice will be the school that drives you mad.

Alia Misthaven
Fiona Frost Weaver

The value of any school depends on your play style and goals. Ice is the most innately defensive class in the game. That makes it slower to quest solo, but hard to defeat and helpful as a team tank. Generally you'll have the highest health, and most shields without using training points or crown gear.

As pointed out in the OP, there are ways to give other schools some of those abilities, and ways for Ice to trade some resist for more damage. It is what you make it.

Mackenzie Moonweav... on Sep 20, 2020 wrote:

A bit surprised that Myth is considered weakest. I don't really have any basis for comparison as I only started playing a few months ago as a myth wizard (conjurer). However I did manage to solo through to the end of Azteca so far (haven't done that yet) except I got some help with the act 3 boss (Meowiarty?) and act 5 boss (Malistaire). My equipment is just what I buy in the bazaar for the most part. Some crafted stuff. I haven't run gauntlets outside of the main and side quests (once) or farmed bosses for equipment, and I don't have hand me down equipment or pets from a previous character. Perhaps you mean Myth is weak when playing in groups. When I started the game it suggested Myth (and Death) were strong for solo play so that's why I chose it. Was that inaccurate or outdated information?

I've had to change strategies several times to progress. It's kept the game interesting.

Myth isn't the weakest anymore. It got a massive buff (especially on the level 48 spell). It's damage to pip got buffed too.